I think that one should keep one's own beliefs to themselves. Without scientific proof there is no factual evidence of anything. Just tales written and people follow them.
God real or not?
Started by
Guest_stubblehamster
, Feb 15 2005 12:22 AM
6399 replies to this topic
#2877
Guest_SENOR NACHO
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Posted 08 January 2006 - 01:23 AM
but there is a slight factual evidence. according to hinduism, god comes down every so often in the form of a human. he denies being a god even is proclaimed one. he is pure and has no or very slight faults. one of these forms was named Rama. he was exiled the forest by one of his mothers. he left with his brother laxman and his wife sita. in the jungle sita was captured by the demon king ravan. he encountered vanars (humans who were not fully evolved but still had human qualities including speech) . the vanars helped rama conquer ravan who lived on sri lanka. but before they got there they had to cross the ocean. being very very long ago, they didnt have large enough boats. rama meditated and came upon a message given to him from a sea sub goddess. she told him to make a bridge with his name of every stone across to lanka. ram did so creating a path of rocks that could float over the water to the other side. a few years ago nasa found this bridge though a satellite image. that kind of counts as proof
#2878
Guest_Anunaki
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Posted 08 January 2006 - 01:27 AM
I don't care at all.Live -> Die -> See what happens.
#2879
Guest_deadman2k4
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Posted 08 January 2006 - 02:22 AM
I herd on the news that this guy is Suing the Vatican for reasons he belive jesus never existed. And he has proff too Like very old jewish books and stuff. I read some about this matter and it says that jesus was a mushroom and god was a big penis lol. And it said that people would eat this shroom and see jesus in a way that he was god of fertility or something and from one person to another the word spread till everyone started beliving jesus. It's a unbeliveble story. To me it dosent really change anything since i am muslim but ethius muslim.
#2880
Guest_peasant_mimiru
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Posted 08 January 2006 - 04:32 AM
If you're Muslim... then you should believe in a God. Or at least Allah. Or some person/dude like that. I think I can offer a reason why God doesn't exist. But that doesn't prove that I don't believe in *something*. Just not God. 
. Okay. 1. Everyone goes to hell, because some religions say that if you aren't part of their religion you go to hell. So everyone goes to hell.2. If everyone goes to hell. There is no such thing as heaven. Unless it's like some teacher's lounge thing that only God and his Saints go to. Or some other idiotic reason. But everyone is equall. Or so said by the Muslims and Sikhs.3. If there is no good, there is no bad. Everything must be balanced or we will all be plunged into chaos. And I mean real chaos. Not war in Middle East / Stupid G.Bush crap.4. If there is no good, there is no God. For God is the embodiment of good. So there. God does not exist. 5. All Holy Books are written by people, PEOPLE. Honestly, do you think God's gonna spend his time writing a 500 pg+ book that tells us what to do and what to believe? And Holy Books are just to explain how this world works.Conclusion: God does not exist. BUT, that does not mean that there is an universal being that is both good and bad. Also, there can be aspects of the universal being (yea I'm leaning way towards Hinduism, even if I'm not one ) But God cannot be an aspect. God's purpose is to watch over us. His opposite is the Devil. The Devil is to watch over Hell. If Hell does not exist, the Devil does not exist, therefore God does not exist.
. Okay. 1. Everyone goes to hell, because some religions say that if you aren't part of their religion you go to hell. So everyone goes to hell.2. If everyone goes to hell. There is no such thing as heaven. Unless it's like some teacher's lounge thing that only God and his Saints go to. Or some other idiotic reason. But everyone is equall. Or so said by the Muslims and Sikhs.3. If there is no good, there is no bad. Everything must be balanced or we will all be plunged into chaos. And I mean real chaos. Not war in Middle East / Stupid G.Bush crap.4. If there is no good, there is no God. For God is the embodiment of good. So there. God does not exist. 5. All Holy Books are written by people, PEOPLE. Honestly, do you think God's gonna spend his time writing a 500 pg+ book that tells us what to do and what to believe? And Holy Books are just to explain how this world works.Conclusion: God does not exist. BUT, that does not mean that there is an universal being that is both good and bad. Also, there can be aspects of the universal being (yea I'm leaning way towards Hinduism, even if I'm not one ) But God cannot be an aspect. God's purpose is to watch over us. His opposite is the Devil. The Devil is to watch over Hell. If Hell does not exist, the Devil does not exist, therefore God does not exist.
Edited by peasant_mimiru, 08 January 2006 - 04:33 AM.
#2881
Guest_Apoc321
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Posted 08 January 2006 - 10:58 PM
That is the best sum up I've ever seen! I'm prouldy christian, and therefore beleive in god and heaven and hell. And only one religion is the right one, right? So it could be some minute one in the middle of Asia for all I know. But even if thats true, it feels right for me to worship god, for you it could be different.If you're Muslim... then you should believe in a God. Or at least Allah. Or some person/dude like that. I think I can offer a reason why God doesn't exist. But that doesn't prove that I don't believe in *something*. Just not God.
. Okay. 1. Everyone goes to hell, because some religions say that if you aren't part of their religion you go to hell. So everyone goes to hell.2. If everyone goes to hell. There is no such thing as heaven. Unless it's like some teacher's lounge thing that only God and his Saints go to. Or some other idiotic reason. But everyone is equall. Or so said by the Muslims and Sikhs.3. If there is no good, there is no bad. Everything must be balanced or we will all be plunged into chaos. And I mean real chaos. Not war in Middle East / Stupid G.Bush crap.4. If there is no good, there is no God. For God is the embodiment of good. So there. God does not exist. 5. All Holy Books are written by people, PEOPLE. Honestly, do you think God's gonna spend his time writing a 500 pg+ book that tells us what to do and what to believe? And Holy Books are just to explain how this world works.Conclusion: God does not exist. BUT, that does not mean that there is an universal being that is both good and bad. Also, there can be aspects of the universal being (yea I'm leaning way towards Hinduism, even if I'm not one
) But God cannot be an aspect. God's purpose is to watch over us. His opposite is the Devil. The Devil is to watch over Hell. If Hell does not exist, the Devil does not exist, therefore God does not exist.
#2882
Guest_Djmix2006
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Posted 08 January 2006 - 11:04 PM
hey u guys need help. stop doing this, this is very wrong, saying there is no god. yes there is a god. god is not a boy, gurl,or animal.god is god. if u dont believe in god u will go to hell.
Edited by Djmix2006, 08 January 2006 - 11:05 PM.
#2883
Guest_Hideyori
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Posted 08 January 2006 - 11:23 PM
If you don't believe in God, how could you go to Hell, a place that God Himself created?
#2884
Guest_Repo_Man
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 01:13 AM
Wow.. That's just mind blowing. I couldn't do that. I've pretended to like some of the presents my parents got me, to make them happy.. But believing if Someone is real or not is just too large a prospect for me to be anything but sincere about. For their sakes, and if not for your own, you should tell them how you really feel. Right or wrong as it is in their eyes.And for all you other people on here who don't believe in the reality of God and His power: There's coming a day when we're going to be leaving. Called away to a heavenly home. But it's going to take more than just believing. You've got to keep your eyes on Jesus and leave this whole world alone.i dont belive in god i just pretend to just to keep my parents happy
#2885
Guest_peasant_mimiru
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 01:22 AM
errrmmmmm... to that dude that quoted my reasoning... i didn't say that you don't have to believe in god... or that there is only one good religion. I'm just saying that's my reasoning. Being proud of your religion is good. I just haven't found a religion that's good enough for me. . And if you want to believe in whatever you want, believe.
Being proud of your religion is good. I just haven't found a religion that's good enough for me. . And if you want to believe in whatever you want, believe.
#2886
Guest_SENOR NACHO
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 01:27 AM
all those people who say were gonna go to hell because people dont beleive in god are wrong. god is a superior being and thus should not expect any thing of us. why create a hell for people to rot in if god himself created those bad thing for people to do. thus there should be no hell. but as for everything else, god, if he does exist, must have created somewhere for people to go after they die. they could be reincarnated over and over, or they could go to heaven, noone knows. and as to there being only one right religion, that too is wrong. all religions hold a key aspect of god, but that doesnt mean its the only one who holds it. for all we know all religions could be half right and half wrong. religion isnt something thats right and wrong, its peoples beliefs so they cant be right or wrong because people will still beleive in them even if they are proven to a different religon.
Edited by SENOR NACHO, 09 January 2006 - 01:28 AM.
#2887
Guest_peasant_mimiru
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 02:05 AM
Okay, if there is no hell, how can there be heaven? I mean come on, people should know that everything must be balanced. That's why there is such thing as a Devil? There has to be counteraspects. What you just said proves what I said.all those people who say were gonna go to hell because people dont beleive in god are wrong. god is a superior being and thus should not expect any thing of us. why create a hell for people to rot in if god himself created those bad thing for people to do. thus there should be no hell. but as for everything else, god, if he does exist, must have created somewhere for people to go after they die. they could be reincarnated over and over, or they could go to heaven, noone knows. and as to there being only one right religion, that too is wrong. all religions hold a key aspect of god, but that doesnt mean its the only one who holds it. for all we know all religions could be half right and half wrong. religion isnt something thats right and wrong, its peoples beliefs so they cant be right or wrong because people will still beleive in them even if they are proven to a different religon.
even if no one goes to hell. I believe in reincarnation more than anything, but unlike Hindus and Sikhs, I don't believe that just gaining wisdom will help us leave the cycle. I don't think ANYTHING can help us leave the cycle. We're stuck on Earth, therefore we live it out. I know all religions hold a key aspect of god. I'm just going against the Christian aspect of God. Considering that the "G" is capitalized and everything. And that it doesn't go by another name.
#2888
Guest_poopyhead25
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 02:08 AM
wow this is such an ancient post haha... anyways.... this topic soon got from "goes god exist" to does god and heaven exist"... but w/eso, the thing is, some of you think that you go to heaven through your own works, but that is entirely different.That is why Jesus christ came down from heaven to die on the cross and come back to life.. to purify us from our sins... "For God so loved the world, He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish bu have eternal life." (John 3:16)God knows that we as pepople are imperfect, but if we accept Jesus as our personal Lord and savior, He will cleanse and forgive us from all our sins, even the ones we did not commit yet. I think the people who cannot enter heaven because they dont believe in God, is that because God is so holy, that sinners who have not accepted Jesus as their Lord and savior (well everyone is a sinner:P) cannot enter heaven"Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6)so ya.. its up to u to believe or notp.s, its prolly better if u believe anyways, (better safe dan sorry rite?)
#2889
Guest_Hideyori
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 02:31 AM
Uhm...I'm slightly confused here...how does that relate to my post? My post was in response to another post saying that if you don't believe in God, you're going to Hell. You cannot go to a place you do not believe in...This is why I hate my own religion....*Sigh* It never ends...Hell is where GOD throws nonbelivers and sinners.There is an Old saying"Hell is GOD's garbage can. Make sure you are not His Garbage.If you don't believe in God, how could you go to Hell, a place that God Himself created?
#2890
Guest_SENOR NACHO
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 03:02 AM
but why must there be constant balance. there is always balance and imbalance for example, god and the devil are not equals, for god must have created the devil meaning the balance falls more towards godOkay, if there is no hell, how can there be heaven? I mean come on, people should know that everything must be balanced. That's why there is such thing as a Devil?all those people who say were gonna go to hell because people dont beleive in god are wrong. god is a superior being and thus should not expect any thing of us. why create a hell for people to rot in if god himself created those bad thing for people to do. thus there should be no hell. but as for everything else, god, if he does exist, must have created somewhere for people to go after they die. they could be reincarnated over and over, or they could go to heaven, noone knows. and as to there being only one right religion, that too is wrong. all religions hold a key aspect of god, but that doesnt mean its the only one who holds it. for all we know all religions could be half right and half wrong. religion isnt something thats right and wrong, its peoples beliefs so they cant be right or wrong because people will still beleive in them even if they are proven to a different religon.
#2891
Guest_sportscamp
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 06:18 AM
Evolution: RealGod: Also RealThe two can coincide so long as you don't take every word in the bible at literal face value. Also, read Finding Darwin's God by Kenneth Miller. Poor creationists and intelligent designists got whipped in that book.
#2892
Guest_zoloft
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 06:49 AM
It's also worth noting that Pope John Paul II put out a statement saying that evolution and Christianity to not conflict with each other.Evolution: RealGod: Also RealThe two can coincide so long as you don't take every word in the bible at literal face value. Also, read Finding Darwin's God by Kenneth Miller. Poor creationists and intelligent designists got whipped in that book.
#2893
Guest_Jabu
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 02:26 PM
www.clarifyingchristianity.com/creation.shtmlThat site gives an excellent comparison of the theories of creation and evolutionm. The amount of ignorance by most people who support evolution concerning this debate is incredible(and annoying). Theyt say creation has no evidence even though there is quite a lot
#2894
Guest_ferr
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 03:21 PM
Due to the omnipotence paradox (If God is all powerful, can he create a rock so heavy that he cannot lift it), the temporality paradox (if God came after the existence of time, then he is restrained by time and not omnipotent, nor is he a first-caused-cause entity; considering God came "before" time is an impossibility as being "before" something would require temportality) which also defeats the cosmological argument; the failure of the ontological argument (which states that if God is omnipotent then to imagine such a being would require the belief that this entity must exist, since the property of existence is an attachment of a greater being, but fails when it is realized that this Greatest Conceivable Being is actually inconceivable due to the fact that it lacks a required attribute, existence, which is similar to attempting to conceive of a three-headed dragon when you can only conceive of one-headed dragons, you simply cannot conceive of such a thing and it is inconceivable); multi-religious societies that conflict with varying denominations and beliefs; the Problem of Evil (which states that if God is truly omni-benevolent then it can never let any sort of "evil" occur, and since it is omnipotent it must always do anything it can to prevent "evil" otherwise it is corrupt and defies the definition of God), etc, etc. It would seem that God, as it is defined, cannot exist.
Edited by ferr, 09 January 2006 - 03:32 PM.
#2895
Guest_MichahSimmons
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Posted 09 January 2006 - 10:48 PM
basically every statement within your post is based upon both illogical, and, I am sorry, yet at the same time content, to say incorrect presuppositions. First, you have misrepresented the question altogether, choosing to present "God" as the religions of today would have you believe, thus enacting the straw-man and red-herring fallacy at the same time, first arguing a point which is not even the subject and secondly taking that point out of ITS context to defeat it for your own benefit. Your first point, time, is completely foundless, as it only points out the average human's ignorance, actually supported by your later point of "belief", showing that when we try to define such a being or its attributes we limit ourselves to our own understandings of physics, or the sciences in general (which have changed over the years). Of course if there were a being such as God he would not be limited to our understanding of science...if he were, he would not be such a being! Your next point follows the same characteristic, assuming that if there is such a being it must be conceivable. The bible itself attests against this, giving examples of people not being able to see God!!! (because they are incapable of conceiving him) Your last point, religions, is completely rediculous; are we to judge Plato by his followers?? or Marx's theories by those who follow them??? Of course not... Likewise, we cannot judge God by denominations who can never even hope to fully understand his entity themselves in the first place. Oh yeah, the point about God not being good...wow. My advice--read the bible and then say that. The explanation of God's unbounding love would take too long, but i can sum most of it up in one word: choice. God loved us so much he gave us a choice. He knows which one we'll make, but he will still allow us to make it because he loves us.Due to the omnipotence paradox (If God is all powerful, can he create a rock so heavy that he cannot lift it), the temporality paradox (if God came after the existence of time, then he is restrained by time and not omnipotent, nor is he a first-caused-cause entity; considering God came "before" time is an impossibility as being "before" something would require temportality) which also defeats the cosmological argument; the failure of the ontological argument (which states that if God is omnipotent then to imagine such a being would require the belief that this entity must exist, since the property of existence is an attachment of a greater being, but fails when it is realized that this Greatest Conceivable Being is actually inconceivable due to the fact that it lacks a required attribute, existence, which is similar to attempting to conceive of a three-headed dragon when you can only conceive of one-headed dragons, you simply cannot conceive of such a thing and it is inconceivable); multi-religious societies that conflict with varying denominations and beliefs; the Problem of Evil (which states that if God is truly omni-benevolent then it can never let any sort of "evil" occur, and since it is omnipotent it must always do anything it can to prevent "evil" otherwise it is corrupt and defies the definition of God), etc, etc. It would seem that God, as it is defined, cannot exist.
#2896
Guest_Kem the Logician
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Posted 10 January 2006 - 12:23 AM
1. He cannot lift it should He hold Himself to it (I.E.; He hasn't wiped us all out yet because He is holding Himself to it). 2. God created time and therefore defies it because He isn't constrained to it. 3. God cannot commit evil, but will allow evil to exist so that humanity will learn it's lesson. Good try dear sir.Due to the omnipotence paradox (If God is all powerful, can he create a rock so heavy that he cannot lift it), the temporality paradox (if God came after the existence of time, then he is restrained by time and not omnipotent, nor is he a first-caused-cause entity; considering God came "before" time is an impossibility as being "before" something would require temportality) which also defeats the cosmological argument; the failure of the ontological argument (which states that if God is omnipotent then to imagine such a being would require the belief that this entity must exist, since the property of existence is an attachment of a greater being, but fails when it is realized that this Greatest Conceivable Being is actually inconceivable due to the fact that it lacks a required attribute, existence, which is similar to attempting to conceive of a three-headed dragon when you can only conceive of one-headed dragons, you simply cannot conceive of such a thing and it is inconceivable); multi-religious societies that conflict with varying denominations and beliefs; the Problem of Evil (which states that if God is truly omni-benevolent then it can never let any sort of "evil" occur, and since it is omnipotent it must always do anything it can to prevent "evil" otherwise it is corrupt and defies the definition of God), etc, etc. It would seem that God, as it is defined, cannot exist.
#2897
-Wade-
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S.B. May you rest in peace.
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Posted 10 January 2006 - 01:04 AM
hmmmm I try to fill you in.... Evil is a term describing that which is regarded as morally bad, intrinsically corrupt, wantonly destructive, inhumane, or wicked. In most cultures, the word is used to describe acts, thoughts, and ideas which are thought to (either directly or causally) bring about withering and death —the opposite of life. However, the definition of what counts as evil differs widely from culture to culture and from individual to individual... Now let keep in mind that God today will not act or cause evil to no one such as " morally bad, intrinsically corrupt, wantonly destructive, inhumane, or wicked" but in bible times God was know to cause evil (it depend how you translate evil when reading the bible) for example Sodom and Gomorrah, were he decribe to doing such an of evil... so according to my interrupatation God can commit Evil but not to the point of being as morally bad, intrinsically corrupt, or wantonly , toward those are good but more like a divine justice toward the wicked .... because I think kemutsemu is thinking the talk that god had with the devil regard Job you can read that on your own it easy to find it the first chapter of Job. But when comes to wicked people as the bible points out many time he's very well capable to commit some sort of evil in the sense of destructive, inhumane, or wicked to the person or people he seem fit.... Now remember this is toward bible times not to our day, as kemutsemu "God cannot commit evil, but will allow evil to exist so that humanity will learn it's lesson" can be true today...The below references show where Sodom the root of the English word Sodomy comes from.KJV Genesis 19:4-5 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter: And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.KJV Genesis 19:24-25 Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven; And he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground. B)
Edited by The Foo Foo bunny Rriders, 10 January 2006 - 01:10 AM.
"A boy has the right to dream. There are endless possibilities stretched out before him. What awaits him down the path, he will then have to choose. The boy doesn't always know. At some point, the boy then becomes an adult, and learns what he was able to become. Joy and sadness forever will accompany this. He is confronted with a choice. When this happens, does he bid his past farewell in his heart? Once a boy becomes an adult, he can no longer go back to being a boy. The boy is now a man. Only one thing can be said. A boy has the right to dream. For those endless possibilities are stretched out before him. We must remember. All men were once boys."
#2898
Guest_zoloft
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Posted 10 January 2006 - 01:15 AM
Why make an exception for your bipolar God?...so according to my interrupatation God can commit Evil
Edited by zoloft, 10 January 2006 - 01:17 AM.
#2899
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Posted 10 January 2006 - 01:35 AM
sorry I must have confuse you some were What I was trying to say is that God can commit act of evil as the definition stated being destructive, inhumane, or wicked but he only have done this toward those he deemed wicked like the city Sodom and Gomorrah thus why he wipe them out, another example is when moses ask pharoh to let his people go and every time he refuse God would send an destructive, inhumane, or wicked plage., but if you read the story of Job the devil Ask that God to case great evil toward Job to see if he will curse him in the face, But God refused, saying that he can't cause evil to those he deem rightoues or good. Thus showing he's not biapolor... To make it simple for you to understand ....When a child misbehave the parent punish the child for being bad (causing evil toward the child) but when the child is good the parent reward the child for being good (thus not causing evil toward the child because he/she was good). God work in a simaler manner be wicked and don't follow his commends bad things will happen but do the opposite good this will happen... but keep this in mind this was according to the biblical times as it mention in revealtion God had remove his hands from the world and let it chose it own path (like a child going of to college and chosing his/her own life A. either follower their own choice or B. follow the instruction that the parent give them) .... Sorry if I made it sound contridictory in my earlier statements if I'm still confusing you keep posting till I can give you a non-confusing satified answerOfftopic@Jon Kim- your an idiot... @zoloft: when in my post did I mention your a retard? I was just clarifing a simple point. and if you don't need condescend don't post it. And that "Two wrongs don't make a right" remark hmmmm you must want to live in some f$%#&* place were they don't punish anyone for any crime... @kemutsemu: yes thank you for seeing my point
Edited by The Foo Foo bunny Rriders, 10 January 2006 - 02:04 AM.
"A boy has the right to dream. There are endless possibilities stretched out before him. What awaits him down the path, he will then have to choose. The boy doesn't always know. At some point, the boy then becomes an adult, and learns what he was able to become. Joy and sadness forever will accompany this. He is confronted with a choice. When this happens, does he bid his past farewell in his heart? Once a boy becomes an adult, he can no longer go back to being a boy. The boy is now a man. Only one thing can be said. A boy has the right to dream. For those endless possibilities are stretched out before him. We must remember. All men were once boys."
#2900
Guest_Kem the Logician
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Posted 10 January 2006 - 01:41 AM
In other words, God does not commit evil, but dispenses harsh retribution. He is no more evil than a parent spanking a malmannered child.
