ok, but can u prove he does exist?That's very nice. Now prove it to me.I challenge any athiest here to give me proof that God does not exist. Come on, all of you. Prove to me that he doesn't exist.RELIGION IS A LIE! I dont really like the thought of religion, i mean what has he done for me. i think its all a plot. im not sure but still, no, i repeat there is no god
God real or not?
Started by
Guest_stubblehamster
, Feb 15 2005 12:22 AM
6399 replies to this topic
#301
Guest_gSeed
Guest_gSeed
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 04:28 PM
#302
Guest_mplacki
Guest_mplacki
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 05:15 PM
Prove, no. Because you can't see God himself, there is no way I can tell you "Hey look, there he is! See? See? He exists!"What I can do (and have been doing) is point out things that in my mind point to the fact that there is a God.Having said that, there is my comment on DNA (which I have yet to hear anyone refute.) There is the fact that chemicals do not randomly interact to new life (otherwise you'd see new species pop up every day, what with all the radioactive particles in the soil and whatnot.) There is the fact that humans are the only creatures on this planet to have an understanding of right and wrong, and to have an understanding of morals - an ability that was not put there by natural selection. But, in and of themselves, none of these is solid, undeniable proof.
#303
Guest_Fallen God
Guest_Fallen God
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 05:29 PM
u cant prove a lot of things but u can see some of the effects lolwot a argumentok, but can u prove he does exist?
#304
Guest_gSeed
Guest_gSeed
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 05:38 PM
ok fair enough, we've established that we cant prove that there is a god, but we can see "some of the effects" so to speak ... can u give me some examples of these so called "effects" ?
Edited by gSeed, 21 February 2005 - 05:39 PM.
#305
Guest_mplacki
Guest_mplacki
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 05:45 PM
^^ I just did.Look back through the topic, I've pointed out a few. I'm too lazy to go back and do it myself.
#306
Guest_gSeed
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 06:20 PM
lol fair enough, it is a lot to read ... :Pyou quoted earlier "Somehow the bacteria had to be created, right? So - if not God, then how was life created?"Ok, from this what I understand is that God is used as a reason to answer a question that is beyond the scope of human knowledge and capacity, what if there were some explantion for it that is not meant to be found for another thousand years or until mankind evolves to its next level?and then later you talk about how humans get their conscience from God -"OK, so. If our conscience didn't come from God, where did it come from?" ...now that together with your other quote stating "What I don't understand is why you have to believe in either science or belief. Why can't you believe in both?"ok so my argument is, when we have thoughts and feelings it is a bunch of chemical reactions that occur inside our bodies and science already proves that, now if we believe there is a God then is that not just Science?I fully respect your beliefs, however from my point of view I see that the reason people believe in God is because they have grown up believing so and see as they mature that God is the answer to many unanswered questions ... so God from my point of view was developed by human thoughts and feelings as we evolved to become more intelligent. And the fact that the way humans think, is chemical then I believe that God is just Science created by the minds of men. He exists in our minds, nowhere else.
#307
Guest_mplacki
Guest_mplacki
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 06:27 PM
I can respect that. There's ultimately no way to prove it one way or another, so to each his own beliefs. 
#308
Guest_gSeed
Guest_gSeed
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 06:29 PM
I can respect that. There's ultimately no way to prove it one way or another, so to each his own beliefs.
agreed.
#309
Guest_HoboStink
Guest_HoboStink
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 07:05 PM
You have to see that god and what people believe is real. But what is very ironic is that religion(Mainly catholicism) is the thing that is false. I mean where in the bilbe does it way to bow down to physical objects like Mary and baby jesus. If anything you thing god would get mad because your worshiping idols? But with that said people would say that if your bowing to a staute of jesus than your bowing to god. that is not right. god lives inside of us (if you have been regenerated) and you dont need stautes to worship. Another big point is the term "church". When people refer to church they think of it as a place to go on sunday, or a physical building. If you look up the word in webster it is "the group of the chosen ones(that being anyone who has been regenerated). So you can say that a church is a group of people that worship god. I think some people reading this will be wonding what regenerated means and how you can become. All this is, is telling god that you believe in him and that he died for you. This is your ticket to not going to hell. I strongly suggest anyone reading this would just in their minds if you want call out to god and recive that lord. But i mean Buring in the lake of fire for eternity doesnt sound bad right?
#310
Guest_Pufaa
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Posted 21 February 2005 - 07:16 PM
Yeah realgion can be a tool to control the masses..... but it can also be a tool to unlock whats inside you to do better things in the world, give you hope, faith, and love.... and thats being spiritual not just realigous
#311
Guest_DivineBlaze
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 03:11 AM
Well, you can count out christianity because it directly goes against evolution which HAS been proved and since one thing in the bible is wrong it all has to be because "god" is infallible and if he is proved to be fallible the universe should come to a halt and end. You see, back in the day when the earth was cooling from being so hot in the big bang it was thunderstorming constantly all over the world im talking like 100000 times a second somewhere in the world and this cause a polarized reaction in the amino acids which fromed into proteins at the right temperature and formed the first organism which multiplied and we all descended from. The chances of this can be expressed with the equation: 1 - (infinity - 1). This is also like thinking that if you had infinity monkeys, infinity typewriters and infinity time, they would eventually type the works of shakespeare. This may seem absurd but its possible because of the 26 letter keys the monkey has to choose one so the chances of him/her/it getting the first letter of a work of shakespeare is 1/26 but getting the first and second is 1/(26 to the -insert number of letters and spaces in works of shakespeare here- power). And then even if you're gonna tell me thats all wrong then heres one more thing that theres no way to prove wrong. Adam and Eve were 2 human beings who in total could have 4 possible alleles for their traits. Skin color is a polygenic trait. which means that theres no possible way for there to be balck people and white people because Adam and Eve were either black brown or white and if two black people get married their children will always be black as will two white peoples be white. Therefore Adam and Eves children could not have populated the world cause then EVERYONE would be either black, white, or brown, not two of them but just one. And the way I see it there are black people and white people and brown people and yellow people which is an adaptation and since evolution is a bunch of adaptations, it must be true. I now command all you christians reading this to convert cause if you still hold on to your religion after me proving it soooo wrong then your just holding on to a useless belief and it will be even worse if the moderators delete this, cause thats showing biased views of the site...and feel free to disprove my religion(hinduism).
#312
Guest_Black Zero
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 03:27 AM
In my Opinion....there beith no God
#313
Guest_Spiral_dragon
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 05:21 AM
I suddenly have a change in heart...something happened that one cannot really explain......so i am saying that there has to some extraterrestrial being out therewith super powers beyond imagine....... still.... there is no GOD...can't be proven with stable evidence
still.... there is no GOD...can't be proven with stable evidence
#314
Riki
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 06:10 AM
Mplacki to rebutt your DNA thing I say that if you look at naturally occuring chemicals in nature you will find complexity in so many substances. You will find magnificant patterns and designs but by no means does this mean that God created it. When you think about it as well the building blocks for like can be created without any help from anyone, all you need for life to begin is time and luck*I would think whatever began life was a fluke*Oh also Mplacki I was just wondering if you can confirm what a friend told me about the Qu'ran, is it true that it says that when God sent the Torah he only gave rules but no reason behind them and when he sent the Bible he gave rules with a bit of reason and when he sent the Qu'ran he gave rules and all the reasons behind them?
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#315
Guest_stubblehamster
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 06:26 AM
I want someone to explain the big bang theory and how it could work.
#316
Guest_mplacki
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 08:10 PM
The Quran itself does not give the reasons behind all of the rules. For some rules it does, but for the most part it does not. The rules were interpreted and explained by the Prophet Mohammad during his lifetime.It does not say anything about the completeness of the other 2 books AFAIK, and I am in no position to speak for them, as I have not read either in its entirety.It's true that many chemicals and substances are very complex. However, nearly all substances have flaws and impurities in their complex patterns. If DNA has flaws in its patterns, the entire organism that depends on that DNA can be completely destroyed, either due to an enzyme failing to be created, or many other reasons.To stubblehamster: The Big Band Theory basicalls states that the universe began with a tiny ball of compressed energy. This ball exploded (Big BangMplacki to rebutt your DNA thing I say that if you look at naturally occuring chemicals in nature you will find complexity in so many substances. You will find magnificant patterns and designs but by no means does this mean that God created it. When you think about it as well the building blocks for like can be created without any help from anyone, all you need for life to begin is time and luck*I would think whatever began life was a fluke*Oh also Mplacki I was just wondering if you can confirm what a friend told me about the Qu'ran, is it true that it says that when God sent the Torah he only gave rules but no reason behind them and when he sent the Bible he gave rules with a bit of reason and when he sent the Qu'ran he gave rules and all the reasons behind them?
) and threw all sorts of matter into the far reaches of the universe. It goes on to say that the universe will eventually stop expanding and gather back into that little ball.I have 2 issues with this theory. 1 issue is: Where did it start? Nothing in the universe has been shown to be infinite and go on in an infinite cycle (unless you count certain decimal numbers, like 1/3). Why should this be the first?Issue 2: If everything is supposedly going to gather back together into one little ball, there has to be a force that pulls everything back together. What force is this? If it was gravity, things would just continue going on as they are now. Stars would supernova and the debris would create new stars with their own centers of gravity and such. So how is everything going to go back into a tiny little ball?
#317
Guest_stubblehamster
Guest_stubblehamster
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 08:35 PM
The only way is god
#318
Guest_mplacki
Guest_mplacki
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 08:41 PM
^^My sentiments exactly.
#319
Guest_Miles_Prower
Guest_Miles_Prower
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 09:02 PM
If says from the religion such as bible, books or Al-Quran sure DO the god is exist. But that is important that god is really exist or not? Why don't belive to self is enough?
#320
Guest_stubblehamster
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Posted 22 February 2005 - 11:16 PM
I dont get how there could be an infinate anything with nothing to create it... how was everything created in the first place if there was no god
#321
Riki
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Posted 23 February 2005 - 05:16 AM
DNA does fail! It is by no means perfect, if anything it is very far from it. Human DNA and the human specimen are inferior to animals physically. There is no more survival for humans so the inferior can breed and create humans with muscle problems and disease. Humanity is flawed and although you may believe DNA to be this great complex thing it is also flawed.
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#323
Guest_Zetman
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Posted 23 February 2005 - 07:34 AM
In a very general sense, I believe in God. But my beliefs are very unsure at the moment. I have a lot of thinking to do..........
#324
Guest_stubblehamster
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Posted 23 February 2005 - 07:59 AM
I still will never get how people cant believe in god
#325
Guest_Dnasty
Guest_Dnasty
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Posted 23 February 2005 - 08:59 AM
I'll still never get why people use God as an excuse to avoid finding the truth B) OMG! Scientific theories are flawed! Boo-hoo.Guess what folks? It's through researched f---ed up concepts like the big bang that we actually get to understand how big man's world's work (Big man = G-d). And it's through that that we began to understand concepts like gravity, medicine, space, and geology (Trust me, geo-studies are more important to your safety than you think). All great things start from scratch.Besides the Big bang is JUST A THEORY! Stop acting like it's been proven!! BLARG!(Yeah, i'm just being the devil's advocate right now. It's late & i'm cranky & I just want to yell at something but that neighbor's cats are asleep, you do the mathI still will never get how people cant believe in god
So g'night all, if you need some stress relief tomorrow you know who to yell at.)Peace out all & enjoy the show B) zzzzzzzzzzzzz ...
Edited by Dnasty, 23 February 2005 - 09:00 AM.
