Edited by dadroz, 31 March 2006 - 10:27 PM.
God real or not?
Started by
Guest_stubblehamster
, Feb 15 2005 12:22 AM
6399 replies to this topic
#3701
Guest_dadroz
Guest_dadroz
-
- Guest
Posted 31 March 2006 - 10:23 PM
Kannade, that's the most annoying outlook on life anybody can have.Somebody can't be right even though the exact opposite of what they believe is right.If somebody believes that 1 + 1 = 3, then fine, they're allowed to believe that and live that way if they want to, but that doesn't make them correct.There either is a God or there isn't. We either live like He is there or we live like He is not there, but ultimately if He really exists and really does have standards that we don't meet and a way of justification that we don't follow, there will be consequences. If He isn't there, then theists are incorrect and there are no consequences.It's the lousiest way to go through life to just not stand for anything and just say "Oh we're ALL right. Let's just hug and be friends and wear flowers and not disagree with each other, even if the truth is important for eternal life."I truly hate confrontation, but I also hate evading discussion and truth.kaliburu, I know that God doesn't 'excist', but He does exist... and He can spell quite well, too
#3702
Guest_Kannade
Guest_Kannade
-
- Guest
Posted 31 March 2006 - 11:14 PM
It's not an outlook on life, it's called "Not forcing people into your religion." It's not like I say that for everything, it's just what I say when people ask if god exists. It's not evading the truth either, it's just letting people think what they want.What consequences can occur if you don't believe that there is a god? The first post of this thread said "I do believe in a god who loves us all." If that were true, no one would be punished for not believing in his existence."the truth is important for eternal life" No it's not. >___> No one lives forever, no matter how honest they are. The most you can get out of telling the truth every minute of your life is getting into heaven when you die.p.s. I DO believe in god. Infact, I believe in dozens of them; I'm a Buddhist.
#3703
Guest_Zansukaru
Guest_Zansukaru
-
- Guest
Posted 01 April 2006 - 01:06 AM
I believe religion is another method of enforcing a moral code over the masses, which isn't a bad thing, but I just don't buy into it all. I'm not biased towards any faith, but when people start talking down to me because I'm agnostic, it really pisses me off.
#3704
Guest_Kem the Logician
Guest_Kem the Logician
-
- Guest
Posted 01 April 2006 - 04:05 AM
Aye, that's called "having an opinion" or "having faith." What you stated in your previous post was that if you believe in something, it's true. That is not "having an opinion" nor is it "having faith," that is a new age philosophy thatIt's not an outlook on life, it's called "Not forcing people into your religion." It's not like I say that for everything, it's just what I say when people ask if god exists. It's not evading the truth either, it's just letting people think what they want.What consequences can occur if you don't believe that there is a god? The first post of this thread said "I do believe in a god who loves us all." If that were true, no one would be punished for not believing in his existence."the truth is important for eternal life" No it's not. >___> No one lives forever, no matter how honest they are. The most you can get out of telling the truth every minute of your life is getting into heaven when you die.p.s. I DO believe in god. Infact, I believe in dozens of them; I'm a Buddhist.
Edited by kemutsemu, 01 April 2006 - 04:14 AM.
#3705
Guest_KoooksMF
Guest_KoooksMF
-
- Guest
Posted 01 April 2006 - 08:30 AM
It doesnt matter what you say, it mattters what you doDont say you believe ina christian god, but ditch church and go to the movies.But I am an athiest
#3706
Guest_dadroz
Guest_dadroz
-
- Guest
Posted 04 April 2006 - 11:17 PM
If it is not evading truth to just believe whatever you want about God and don't discuss your beliefs with others, what is it? If there is truth that people don't try to seek and share, the only other option is evasion. Why is it that people sometimes single out religion/faith as the one thing they don't want to argue about? People argue about politics and most other things in life, so why has a time come where we don't want to discuss moral accountability and consequence?Whatever eastern religions teach, there is truth, and that truth is important. Eternal life does not mean eternal physical life in this body; it means eternal spiritual life, i.e. heaven. If you're a buddhist, you at least believe that something happens to our soul after the physical death. Or is nothing eternal? You yourself mentioned "getting into heaven when you die"... if there is a condition to meet in order for that to happen and you don't meet it... isn't the way, the truth, and the life relevant?What Christians believe is that there is one physical lifetime followed by either eternal unity with God or eternal separation from God, and what happens to your soul is determined not by what you do but by the condition of your heart and faith, which manifests itself in what you do. In that physical lifetime, nobody is perfect in actions, but they can become perfect in heart and mind.If there is only one God as opposed to many, and if he does love us all, but only forgives us if we depend on Him, then whatever you believe is irrelevant, because no repentance = eternal separation. If you don't believe that there is one God who incorporates both love and judgment, fine, that belief is still relevant. But there's always that chance that you might be incorrect.People who try to convince others that there is or isn't a God do so because they believe firmly that something is true and relevant to people's eternal state, so they want to pass it on. I don't need somebody to agree for me to like them, but of course I would like it if people agreed. In the end, though, it's anybody's choice and it would be foolish to try to make somebody believe. But nobody has to stop the discussion.It's not an outlook on life, it's called "Not forcing people into your religion." It's not like I say that for everything, it's just what I say when people ask if god exists. It's not evading the truth either, it's just letting people think what they want.What consequences can occur if you don't believe that there is a god? The first post of this thread said "I do believe in a god who loves us all." If that were true, no one would be punished for not believing in his existence."the truth is important for eternal life" No it's not. >___> No one lives forever, no matter how honest they are. The most you can get out of telling the truth every minute of your life is getting into heaven when you die.p.s. I DO believe in god. Infact, I believe in dozens of them; I'm a Buddhist.
There's nothing wrong with agnosticism; there's always something we don't know. But religion doesn't have to control people. The Christian response to that idea is that before somebody is spiritually reborn, we are controlled by our feelings. We can do good sometimes, but if we have an impulse to do something wrong, we are in no condition to resist that impulse. As far as many atheists and agnostics are concerned, there may not be any long-term consequences for our actions, anyway. That is the crutch for the weak and the way people are manipulated, not faith. Religion and faith are different, by the way. In our man-made religions and rituals, we still stand imperfect, but we can be justified by grace through faith. Faith in God through Jesus Christ is the only true faith, because every other religion says that man is either ok to do whatever he wants or that we are imperfect but we can become closer to God by doing certain things. Neither one is true. We're imperfect, and something imperfect is incapable of becoming perfect. Society is not evolving into something better. One need only realize that we've been here at least a few thousand years and we're still suffering from war, famine, crime, etc... Man needs God and God will accept man on one condition: faith in His son paying for our imperfection. When we repent, the Holy Spirit renews us, and we are truly free. The true sets free; it doesn't restrict anybody. As a Christian, I can do whatever I, in my spirit, want to do. Before I was bound by whatever my body wanted. Christians do things wrong, but they have the ability now to learn from those things and please God by not continuing in the same imperfect habit.I believe religion is another method of enforcing a moral code over the masses, which isn't a bad thing, but I just don't buy into it all. I'm not biased towards any faith, but when people start talking down to me because I'm agnostic, it really pisses me off.
If there is truth, then somebody's opinion/faith is wrong and/or misguided.If you say there is no solid truth, I ask you if you are absolutely sure? If you are sure, then you believe a statement of truth, that "there is no solid truth." That doesn't make sense. Only "there is truth, but we don't know everything" can be true, in which case some are wrong and some are right. But wrong and right are relative, because nobody is ultimately perfect. So we need God's grace and Spirit to redeem us. If you believe whatever you want to believe, that's fine, you may do so, but you'll either be correct or incorrect, and there will either be good or bad consequences. If you want, just don't believe in consequences, but that won't change them.Aye, that's called "having an opinion" or "having faith." What you stated in your previous post was that if you believe in something, it's true. That is not "having an opinion" nor is it "having faith," that is a new age philosophy thatIt's not an outlook on life, it's called "Not forcing people into your religion." It's not like I say that for everything, it's just what I say when people ask if god exists. It's not evading the truth either, it's just letting people think what they want.What consequences can occur if you don't believe that there is a god? The first post of this thread said "I do believe in a god who loves us all." If that were true, no one would be punished for not believing in his existence."the truth is important for eternal life" No it's not. >___> No one lives forever, no matter how honest they are. The most you can get out of telling the truth every minute of your life is getting into heaven when you die.p.s. I DO believe in god. Infact, I believe in dozens of them; I'm a Buddhist.
amounts to crapdoesn't even amount to a n00b's oppinion. The philosophy I go by would have to be "Believe what you want, it's your choice. Just make sure that your choice counts in the long run."
Hypocrisy is the biggest problem with 'Christians'. But hypocrisy doesn't make the faith wrong or right.It just makes the hypocrite wrong.It doesnt matter what you say, it mattters what you doDont say you believe ina christian god, but ditch church and go to the movies.But I am an athiest
#3707
···
-
- Dragon's Elite
-
- 928 posts
·
Reputation: 0
Neutral
Posted 05 April 2006 - 02:26 AM
Think about the creation of everything. If there was a Big Bang, then something had to create the matter. Matter can't be formed from nothing. There has to be a superior being that has always existed, an infinite chain of superior beings, or a group of superior beings that has always existed or have created each other, starting with one or many. It can't be a chain, because something has to have created the first, or the first had to have always existed. That leaves one or a group. Any way you look at the creation of the universe, there has to be a superior being, a God, or more than one.Answering the topic question, yes, I believe in God.
Someone, make something better.
#3708
Guest_Vithushanj
Guest_Vithushanj
-
- Guest
Posted 05 April 2006 - 03:22 AM
I'm an Epicureanist...basically, I believe that there MAY be a celestial being (otherwise known as a god), but this being has no REAL impact in our lives
#3709
Guest_orbits
Guest_orbits
-
- Guest
Posted 05 April 2006 - 09:36 AM
I do not believe in god, but i do believe jesus was real
#3710
Guest_jasonian
Guest_jasonian
-
- Guest
Posted 06 April 2006 - 01:08 PM
Logically, a god who is omnipotent (all powerful), omniscient (all seeing), and benevolent (all good) connot exist alongside suffering.your 'god' either cannot do anything about the suffering, cannot see it, or is indifferent to it.I.E. 'He' is either weak, blind or evil.This is a well known philosophical argument. I've never heard anything other than a feeble parry from a believer.
#3711
Guest_Kem the Logician
Guest_Kem the Logician
-
- Guest
Posted 07 April 2006 - 02:31 AM
Wait... Since when is justice called suffering? We screw with God and God screws with us.
I think you misunderstood me there. All absolute truths cannot be bent for if they can then they are no longer truths. I'm a Christian and I believe that people should be free to believe whatever they want. But just because I support religious freedom does not mean I support relativity, and just because they believe something doesn't make that something true.If there is truth, then somebody's opinion/faith is wrong and/or misguided.If you say there is no solid truth, I ask you if you are absolutely sure? If you are sure, then you believe a statement of truth, that "there is no solid truth." That doesn't make sense. Only "there is truth, but we don't know everything" can be true, in which case some are wrong and some are right. But wrong and right are relative, because nobody is ultimately perfect. So we need God's grace and Spirit to redeem us. If you believe whatever you want to believe, that's fine, you may do so, but you'll either be correct or incorrect, and there will either be good or bad consequences. If you want, just don't believe in consequences, but that won't change them.
Edited by kemutsemu, 07 April 2006 - 02:42 AM.
#3712
Guest_dadroz
Guest_dadroz
-
- Guest
Posted 07 April 2006 - 03:07 AM
Jasonian, I really don't care if you consider this a 'feeble parry', but ask yourself who actually causes the suffering. Evil doesn't just happen by itself, so that we can say "why does God allow suffering?" and actually turn it round to make Him the cause. Some religious fanatics may think it's God, and they may think that if they so desire, but according to the Bible (and rationally looking at ourselves and others), it is us who harm ourselves and others, because we are less than perfect in thoughts, words, and deeds. God simply lets us carry on doing whatever we want to do, because He gave us free will. It is His omnipotence, omnipresence, and omniscience that make it all make sense. I mean, He knows how it will turn out for the greater good and we don't. Free will exists so that we can choose to be with Him for eternity or choose not to. If we don't choose to seek God, He doesn't impose on us (then He really wouldn't be loving). But there is a peace that can be had spiritually in spite of our physical suffering if we choose to acknowledge Him and others above ourselves.He is more intelligent than us and has a higher plan that we can hardly comprehend. I believe God is higher than us, and that means the spiritual life is also higher than this material existence. A higher spiritual life means that it really doesn't matter that there is suffering, in my life or anybody else's, because it's just temporary and there is eternal relief for those who seek it in Christ, God's extra chance for us that we don't deserve. Of course, if you start out not believing in God and not wanting to know Him even if He is there, you certainly won't want to accept that we should accept suffering in this life. The truth is that nobody is perfect, and if nobody is perfect, nobody deserves a perfect life. We don't deserve for God to help us out, but He will IF we ask Him. And God helping doesn't mean removing all problems; it means helping us to grow as a result of handling the problems well and helping us to know Him and be like Him gradually. There would be no reconciliation experience if it was just a case of saying "God" and Him taking us to heaven.What it seems you would prefer about God is the ability to do whatever you want, living according to your own impulses no matter what is best for you, and yet have no consequences. You seem frustrated at the prospect of a God who would allow us to suffer for our own imperfection and who would have the audacity (and, as far as you see it, lack of love) to let us reap what we sow. It might, for all you or I know, actually be the most loving thing God could do, because suffering draws somebody who seeks God nearer to Him. He is the crutch for the weak. The problem is that not everybody will admit they are weak or settle for a challenging, long-term solution. We all want strength and we all want it now. I'm glad God doesn't obey us, because we'd be even more bratty than we are.Should God focus everything He does on us despite the fact that we don't seek Him wholeheartedly? In short, God is allowing us to use our free will however we wish (in a less than perfect way), but He will work all things to good for those that love Him. If you don't like the answer or don't understand, it could be because you don't want to love and/or understand God, but I don't know.Just keep seeking the truth and be willing to be wrong. There's no reason to fear the search for God if you're sure He isn't there. I am not scared of the prospect of God not existing, firstly because those in relationship with Him experience Him regularly, and secondly because anybody else not believing is irrelevant to my understanding of life.
Edited by dadroz, 07 April 2006 - 03:19 AM.
#3713
Guest_jasonian
Guest_jasonian
-
- Guest
Posted 07 April 2006 - 03:29 PM
no offence to you, but i do XDyou're redefining benevolent, by saying that starving children in africa (apoplogies for the oft-used cliche) can be helped by god in a spiritual sense, rather than a physical one, and dismissing physical suffering as unimportant, compared to the infinity that is the afterlife.I agree that the ills of this world are man-made, but that's no reason for 'our father's indifference.If you had two children, and one was causing the other to suffer, as a father (or parent figure) would you intervene, or would you conclude that what they did to one another was their own fault and a learning experience and do nothing.I'm not an atheist, just an agnostic, who has yet to be swayed by a persuasive argument. I find the idea of no afterlife far less frightening than the idea of deity who would willfully allow his followers to suffer atrocities while offering only spirituality for them to cling to.just so you know, I'm not trying to cause offense, these are just my opinions, and I would like to hear your answers to my questions, and your views on what i say.thanks.Jasonian, I really don't care if you consider this a 'feeble parry'...
#3714
Guest_dadroz
Guest_dadroz
-
- Guest
Posted 08 April 2006 - 04:49 PM
Actually, jasonian, I really like your thoughts, because you hit the root issue with Christianity as opposed to any other faith or lack thereof. Christianity does indeed redefine benevolence, and that's why so many religious leaders hated Jesus. He wasn't actually saying that Judaism was wrong in its laws, but that more was required for righteousness than just to fulfill those laws. Righteousness can’t be superficial. People find Christianity hard today, also, because the Bible doesn't say that you can be good enough for God externally or that God solves all of our obvious problems.It is that issue of priority that you identified, in that Christianity requires the spiritual life to be set above everything else. When we do "seek first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness... all these things will be added" (Matthew 6:34). God takes care of us physically when we prioritize His spiritual reign in our lives. That doesn't mean believers in Jesus Christ never have any problems (they have been and are still persecuted in some parts of the world for their beliefs), but food and drink, clothing and shelter will come, as we need them in the time we do have. The reason faith doesn't make you live this earthly life forever is that our time on Earth after being spiritually reborn and becoming a child of God is merely to pass it on to others. If the most effective way to show God's love for mankind is to die for your faith, that's ok. Jesus summed this up by being perfect, but giving up heaven to ensure that we could be forgiven.Now, I'm saying things you've already told me you disagree with, because you don't like the idea of physical suffering being declared ok in the name of spiritual bliss. That's ok; I often don't feel like prioritizing the spiritual in my life either, because it's hard to do sometimes. But I'll mention the alternative and tell you why things are so.Ask yourself this, where will you be eternally? If you definitely don't believe in God or any kind of spiritual existence, then I guess this is irrelevant (except for the questions that grate inside you about who we are, what reality is, where we come from, when things will improve, how everything came to be, and why). No spiritual existence means that we will live this life, die, and cease to exist, so we can do whatever we want to now with no lasting consequences. But most people don’t give themselves over to sex, drugs, violence, theft, etc… because they know somewhere inside them that they want to live well. So if you do believe that there might be a spiritual existence, knowing that this physical existence is maybe going to be just 70 or 80 years long at the most if you don't get hit by a car, shot, etc… then surely it is as a spiritual being that we will exist eternally, right? I mean, physical things, by definition, are temporary (bound by time), and spiritual things are eternal. So how could contentment in this life now be the priority? We COULD choose to depend on the growth of science and technology, but we actually know that that won’t grant us eternity, so why would physical and emotional suffering around the world and in our own individual lives be more important than God offering us spiritual peace now through the imperfect physical life and later in a solely spiritual realm?Now, it's all very well saying that the spirit might be more important than the flesh, but WHY does the flesh have to suffer at all? Again, it is because of our free will. The least loving thing God could do is to create drones, so He created us for a willing relationship with Him and allowed us to choose anything, but we keep choosing anything but Him. Instead of us being robot slaves, we may do as we please, though it leads to suffering, and God will keep giving us chance after chance to seek Him, know Him, and love Him. In fact, if He knows in His infinite foreknowledge that there is anything He could do to draw us to Him, HE will seek us. He already knows us (He made us), and He already loves us (even though we are rebellious), so God by no means says that He likes suffering to take place. But like I said, He's infinite, including foreknowledge, so He knows that if He attracts spiritually those who seek Him, the suffering will be worth it in the long-term. Why would the short-term be more important? Those who continue to reject Him no matter what merely express that they don't want spiritual perfection. It isn’t that God made hell because He’s bitter and hateful and vindictive; it’s just that separation from God IS hell. The Bible tries to portray how horrible it is by using the picture of burning, but even that doesn’t really come close. The world is bad today, but we have no concept of life entirely without God. Emotional and spiritual suffering are worse than burning, but if that’s what we decide and God does not consider it loving to take away free will, then there is hell, as we condemn ourselves not by our actions (everybody is equal), but by the focus of our heart, soul, strength, and mind.To wrap ourselves up in why we can't do whatever we want and still have wonderful lives is not really stupid, but it is somewhat irrelevant. Whatever we think about who God is and what we think He should be, we are the ones who are imperfect, and that is observable rationally. We all make mistakes and every action has consequences. That doesn't make mankind evil, but it certainly means we need a God who wants to redeem us. Why do we choose to do things we shouldn't? That's a question you have to ask yourself. That's why it's a free will, because you control what you do freely. You can even question God. Why does He allow suffering? Well, He lets us choose, so why do we make mistakes that cause suffering? I know for myself that I actually can't help it. Is that fair? I was just born that way; I was born imperfect. Well, I can’t change that. That’s just how it is, so now I am left with this decision alone, will I seek God's solution? Will I desire His perfection and accept His Way (Jesus Christ), His Truth (learned through personal experience, human reason, the testimony of others, historical and archaeological evidence always supporting biblical record, and confirmed by His Holy Spirit), and His Life (the higher spiritual life)?We must all decide our answer personally, based on the Spirit of God working in us. What do you decide?All other religions - please challenge this if you disagree - either say:1. That there is no perfect state, but we are constantly evolving,2. That we are already perfect and issues of right and wrong are relative, or3. That we are not perfect, but we can become so by religious obedience/ritualsThe Bible's unique perspective is that God is perfect, He has a perfect standard for us made up of absolute rights and wrongs, we do not live up to the standard (we are not perfect, so we make mistakes) and cannot justify ourselves by religious/physical means or reach any kind of perfection in thoughts, words, and deeds. But God will accept us based on spiritual perfection (a heart and soul that love Him and a renewed strength and mind that seek Him through Jesus Christ) instead of physical perfection, simply by confessing that although it seems like foolishness, we will believe that He sent His Son to die for our sins and we will follow Him as well as we are able.As a result of turning our heart, soul, strength, and mind to God, He dwells in us by His Holy Spirit and perfects us from the inside out. Christianity does not excuse sin, but it says that sin has to be dealt with inwardly, not outwardly. There is no perfect inner self to find, because it is inner rebellion and imperfection that cause the exterior wrongdoings, and there is no perfect outer self to find, because until somebody is transformed by the renewing of their mind, heart, and spirit, they won't stop making mistakes, whether in deeds, words, or just thoughts.I have suffered at different times in my life and in different ways, but not anywhere near as much as some have. I can say that the answer to my broken family, in some ways a lost childhood, depression, addiction to pornography, bitterness, envy, anger, pride, and any other problems or imperfections I've had (emotional, financial, intellectual, etc...) has been coming into a personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ and depending on Him for a plan. I can't speak FOR the starving inhabitant of a 3rd world country because I haven't experienced starvation, and I can't speak FOR the refugee from a war-torn country, because I haven't experienced war, but I can speak TO them based on the consistent answer to every one of my problems so far.Jesus Christ's answer to suffering people was that the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand, which is the simple Gospel, or good news, that most Christians reject in favor of talking about the crucifixion. While it's true biblically that the way in which people enter the Kingdom of Heaven is through belief in the atoning death of Christ for our imperfections, the end goal is a lot more important to emphasize than the means. Belief in Christ as Lord and Savior or mankind leads to a secure, spiritual life in the midst of the suffering.Tell me, based on this, will you choose to prioritize long-term fulfillment by the reign of the heavenly/spiritual/eternal/abundant life over short-term gratification by the reign of the earthly/fleshly/temporary/inadequate life by putting faith in Jesus Christ, our Lord, and asking Him to forgive you of your imperfections and help you to live an acceptable life before God our Father by means of the Holy Spirit?
Edited by dadroz, 08 April 2006 - 05:03 PM.
#3715
Guest_dadroz
Guest_dadroz
-
- Guest
Posted 11 April 2006 - 03:08 PM
All communication is based on truth being absolute. If you say "X is Y" and believe that your statement carries any kind of meaning, you admit to absolute truth.To say "reality IS relative" (which is a logical statement that requires the existence of solid truth to be valid) and to expect people to take you seriously, you admit that absolute truth exists, because we all have to agree on certain rules of language in order for others to know what we are saying. We all know what the words 'reality', 'is', and 'relative' mean, so we know what you are trying to communicate and we can either agree or disagree with you.It isn't really about whether truth exists, because if you say "truth does not exist" and you expect me to understand that you believe that truth does not exist, you must be lying. Without absolute reality, you could not communicate anything to anybody on this board by your posts.Are reality and truth absolutely relative? Or are they just relatively relative?If you're absolutely sure they're relative, then there are absolutesIf you're only relatively sure, you might just as well be absolutely unsure
Edited by dadroz, 11 April 2006 - 10:12 PM.
#3716
Guest_evil_twin
Guest_evil_twin
-
- Guest
Posted 12 April 2006 - 12:50 PM
God real or not?NOT deffentallywhere is the evedence that he is realmy life is poo (prob cause i dont beleive but hey)and i beleve in the Big Bang ove a bunch of BullS*#T bout some allmighty guy that can control everythineven if he is real who cares its not like you live longer if you beleve in him(btw my freind was a belever and died at 15 cause of a car accedent)so if god was real wouldnt he like to keep his belevers alive rather then let them die............ok ive had my say
#3717
Guest_crazy mike
Guest_crazy mike
-
- Guest
Posted 12 April 2006 - 03:37 PM
Lets talk about how the bible and christains today are incasistent 1 jesus wus born during tax seson not winter yet the celibrate his birth in the middle of winter. eggs have nothing to do with jesus and easter celibrats jesus's resurection witch was 3 days after his death witch was near his birth in date. these inconsistancies prove he is not real hes made up like an imaginary friend 
#3718
Guest_dadroz
Guest_dadroz
-
- Guest
Posted 12 April 2006 - 04:47 PM
The influences of paganism on Christianity by way of the Catholic church don't actually prove anything about the historical, biblical Jesus. Those influences prove the imperfection and inconsistency of humanity.To every argument against God based on the problems with humanity: Humanity is flawed and God is not, so it doesn't matter what we think about Him. What matters is that His will will be done no matter what, but it makes sense for us to agree with it. Everything physical has to have a beginning and an end. Everything spiritual has no beginning or end. Human logic cannot argue for or against God, so He won't give you any evidence other than His presence in creation.We all know God exists, we just don't all admit it, because we're rebellious and selfish by nature and often don't want to give up our human fleshly nature.
#3719
Guest_jasonian
Guest_jasonian
-
- Guest
Posted 12 April 2006 - 06:22 PM
nice.if we believe, you are right, if we don't we're just kidding ourselves and you are right.reminds me of Freud.We all know God exists, we just don't all admit it, because we're rebellious and selfish by nature and often don't want to give up our human fleshly nature.
Edited by jasonian, 12 April 2006 - 06:23 PM.
#3720
Guest_4dd1ct3dg4m3r
Guest_4dd1ct3dg4m3r
-
- Guest
Posted 12 April 2006 - 07:50 PM
i believe in God. here's the thing..even if He wasn't real..at least i have a belief.i believe that i will live an eternal life !!! i had a teacher who used to say.. if there was a God and u believed in Him, u would go to Heaven, if there wasn't and u still believed..there's no harm...if there was a God and u didn't believe..u'll go to hell.. and if there wasn't ..wellwould u take the risk?
#3721
Guest_Kem the Logician
Guest_Kem the Logician
-
- Guest
Posted 12 April 2006 - 11:13 PM
The Catholic Church stole the holidays from the Pagans. There are around five possible days in which Jesus may have been born, December 25th is one of'em.Lets talk about how the bible and christains today are incasistent 1 jesus wus born during tax seson not winter yet the celibrate his birth in the middle of winter. eggs have nothing to do with jesus and easter celibrats jesus's resurection witch was 3 days after his death witch was near his birth in date. these inconsistancies prove he is not real hes made up like an imaginary friend
#3722
Guest_Gangsta Geek
Guest_Gangsta Geek
-
- Guest
Posted 23 April 2006 - 04:45 AM
Why do you believe the exsistance of the big bang but doubt the exsistance of a real god. And what is the purpose of a longer life if you aren't going to believe in it. God can't control everything. He can't control human will or those influenced by it. If your life is really s**t then you need to do something to improve it. It doesn't nessasarily mean religion, you can just do karate, play basketball, hang out with friends, DO SOMETHING!!!! Why do you say you don't believe in god, but then blame him for all your problems? Thats the problem with most atheists, they talk about how bad god is but they don't believe in him. How can you have emotions through someone who doesn't exist ?God real or not?NOT deffentallywhere is the evedence that he is realmy life is poo (prob cause i dont beleive but hey)and i beleve in the Big Bang ove a bunch of BullS*#T bout some allmighty guy that can control everythineven if he is real who cares its not like you live longer if you beleve in him(btw my freind was a belever and died at 15 cause of a car accedent)so if god was real wouldnt he like to keep his belevers alive rather then let them die............ok ive had my say
Wow. All I can say is, I am moved by your greatness :bow:The influences of paganism on Christianity by way of the Catholic church don't actually prove anything about the historical, biblical Jesus. Those influences prove the imperfection and inconsistency of humanity.To every argument against God based on the problems with humanity: Humanity is flawed and God is not, so it doesn't matter what we think about Him. What matters is that His will will be done no matter what, but it makes sense for us to agree with it. Everything physical has to have a beginning and an end. Everything spiritual has no beginning or end. Human logic cannot argue for or against God, so He won't give you any evidence other than His presence in creation.We all know God exists, we just don't all admit it, because we're rebellious and selfish by nature and often don't want to give up our human fleshly nature.
#3723
Guest_rikku5566
Guest_rikku5566
-
- Guest
Posted 23 April 2006 - 04:49 AM
me I do not beleve in god because I suposely am going agenst the bibel and on top of that u can not spread rumors well that is what my small group said that I used to go to with my friend untell they said we were siners
#3724
Guest_GlassDanse
Guest_GlassDanse
-
- Guest
Posted 23 April 2006 - 06:39 AM
a god can exist with religion existing. a religion is a group. someone can believe in a god without being with a group.and those who believe in the divine intervention theory, why would you want to believe in that in the first place? you like the fact that you were given the chance to sin and die and not just let into heaven? even if God does exist (don't quote me), why wouldn't you want to believe you evolved from a completely different species? that you weren't made as flawed a creature as you are now, that there'll always be another evolutionary step to take... and the fact that it can be duplicated again? isn't that a clue? that you aren't a divine species? anyways, that's enough for today's lesson, feel free to reply to this, and No, Flamming!.Well if God exists then Religion has to exist.Both are inextricably intertwined.& Christianity isnt a conspiricy.. loland those who believe in the big bang theory, why would you want to believe in that in the first place? you like the fact that you were spec's that evolved into bigger specs and after soo long became a human? even if God Doesnt exist (which he does), why wouldnt you want to believe that you were created by God? that you didnt just evolve from some crap floating around in space that evovled.. and the fact that it cant be duplicated again? isnt that a clue? that u arent an evolved species? anyways, thats enough for todays lesson, feel free to reply to this, and No Flamming.God exists, religion doesn't.
Edited by GlassDanse, 23 April 2006 - 06:41 AM.
#3725
Guest_Cmndr_bunbun
Guest_Cmndr_bunbun
-
- Guest
Posted 23 April 2006 - 03:28 PM
i mormon so god exists and we got where we are now with no army no government backing us up and money coming in by ppls own generosity.The only one of those three any other religion can say is the money one. But most do it to "save there soul"
