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Abortions

Started by Guest_xero212121 , Dec 18 2007 12:33 PM

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#351 Guest_Balore

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Posted 10 August 2008 - 03:55 AM

broken condoms could still be seen as the act of carelessness as well, forgeting to pinch the top? thats just your own fault man. rape also seems to be the only logical reason to get rid of your child. but even then, by the time of conception, thats life inside that womans uterus.

Excuse me? Broken condoms are no one's fault, really. They just happen on rare occasions. When you're raped, a child isn't magically conceived instantaneously. There's still ample time to preform an abortion at the appropriate level.

and preventing life is NOT a bad thing? seeing a little "you" grow up (depending how you raise the kid) and flourish NOT an accomplishing feeling? despite the fact it could be a rape child, aborting is a cowards way out"oh, i got raped and preganant, let me kill the fetus and carry on with life, who cares about an insignificant thing that could be an immense help to society, or a great trouble, OH WELL, lets just kill it."

No, preventing a potential life is not a bad thing. It has no experiences in life to miss - no feelings towards anything at all. It just simply is not a human at that stage. What does the accomplishing feeling of seeing your child grow up have to do with anything? Not everyone is ready for the commitment of parenthood, nor can everyone afford the time and effort, as well as monetary support, necessary for sustaining a decent life for both themselves and their child.As you've pointed out, the chances of the child growing up to be a help to society or a burden are the same, so what was the point of even mentioning it? Allow me to sarcastically and mockingly summarize your position: "Who cares whether or not the parents have the ability or financial support necessary for supporting a family? This child, which can't even be considered as such at this point, could potentially grow up to be a kind and loving individual who could revolutionize the world as we know it! Of course, it's equally as likely that they won't, or that they grow up to be a heartless killer, but come on, people; it could change the world for the better! The possibility is still there! Undeveloped life that could grow up to be anything is far more important than the already-established life it's growing off of! It's so obvious!"

Edited by Balore, 10 August 2008 - 03:58 AM.

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#352 Guest_SkeLa10

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 05:09 PM

WAY AGAINST, why not think before u act if u aint ready for no kid use protection or dont have sex at all why kill an innocent for others mistake sounds so DUMB!POINTS were deducted for this post by KHRSPlease refer to the forum rules to find out why your points were deducted.
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#353 Guest_ScaredyLuigi

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Posted 28 August 2008 - 04:41 PM

I personally am more neutral on this topic, but I also consider it situational.My reasoning?If a baby is still about or under 4 months (or whatever the certain time is), it will be confirmed to have no feeling, and therefore, aborting it isn't too bad of an idea...no harm done to anyone. In situations where the baby has developed to an extent, I am normally anti-choice (or whatever the opposite of pro-choice is), but there can be an exception if sex to the female was either forced by someone or unless it was some other type of rape/nonconsensual sex. Then, I am fully pro-choice because the woman didn't have ANY choice in the first place.However, if the woman was too...stupid (for lack of a better term) to remind her boyfriend/partner/husband to put the ol' Trojan on, then she has some kind of fault in it and the baby should be held responsible to her. Of course, I don't really care personally if the abortion issues don't affect me, but if this were to happen to someone I know, that's what I would say.
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#354 Guest_youngidealist

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Posted 28 August 2008 - 08:40 PM

The trouble is, most people who have strong opinions about this issue on both sides would agree to the very compromises that would make this issue moot. I'm afraid that the subject of abortion is just a detour of our efforts and attention that politicians can fix but that they don't want to because it helps to make controlling the vote and distracting from really hard topics that much easier.For example, both sides use points to argue their case that are based on current standards and practices. Often from the self proclaimed "pro-life" side you get pictures of horrendous things that are being done to fetuses under the current status quo, like decapitating the fetus and pulling the body out before the head just to satisfy the legal qualifications. This is often somehow argued alongside a shear ignorance of the scientifically defined difference between a zygote and an embryo as well as a refusal to discuss bioethics or the case in which the mother's life is in jeopardy. The opposition of self proclaimed "pro-choice" supporters often reply with equal passion in question of those points ignored. All of this while both sides are simply ignoring why nothing about which they agree upon is ever fixed. Abortion needs to be a discussion and be given a dialogue between our country's leaders showing how the status quo itself can be made into a much more agreed upon compromise. On top of this, if both sides were spending just as much effort in fixing the problems of this country's adoption methods and laws or spent as much effort in giving a REAL education to high school students in sex ed (like that which currently is only learned in a college course called "Psychology of Human Sexuality") then the case would be moot because abortion would become unnecessary if those problems were fixed. However, as I say this, my political position currently would be to keep the current status quo of pro-choice with current limitations until the other issues are taken care of. In states where abortion is not an option I would still vote towards making it so until the real issues are dealt with, because I know that without abortion being present, the right wing would just ignore the suffering of our orphans and a lack of sex education just as they do today.
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#355 Guest_awsomedude262

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Posted 29 August 2008 - 08:29 AM

Im anti abortion. please dont just bite my head off. if you've gotten pregnant it was not "by accedent" an accident is two people running naked down the street, running into each other and some how getting pregnant. If you got yourself into the situation of pregnancy, as far as im concerned you have the responsability to carry it to term and put it up for adoption if you dont feel equiped to care for the child
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#356 Guest_youngidealist

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Posted 29 August 2008 - 09:14 AM

Im anti abortion. please dont just bite my head off. if you've gotten pregnant it was not "by accedent" an accident is two people running naked down the street, running into each other and some how getting pregnant. If you got yourself into the situation of pregnancy, as far as im concerned you have the responsability to carry it to term and put it up for adoption if you dont feel equiped to care for the child

Yeah, like I said before, adoption has it's own issues. Like kids getting raped in foster homes and the foster parents somehow getting more immunity from the law than a teacher.
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#357 Guest_DeinKonig

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 06:36 AM

Yeah, like I said before, adoption has it's own issues. Like kids getting raped in foster homes and the foster parents somehow getting more immunity from the law than a teacher.

So... keep the status quo and focus on fixing the adoption system? Seems like more would get done that way.
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#358 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 07 September 2008 - 11:49 PM

The mother shouldn't have the choice. The baby should be able to live. Abortion is immoral and murder. If a pregnant mother was say, hit by a car and the baby was killed, everyone would say "the baby was killed." No one would say "Oh well, the fetus just died." Life begins on Conception!

Edited by ♠ Sucramnella, 07 September 2008 - 11:49 PM.

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#359 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 07 September 2008 - 11:52 PM

The mother shouldn't have the choice. The baby should be able to live. Abortion is immoral and murder. If a pregnant mother was say, hit by a car and the baby was killed, everyone would say "the baby was killed." No one would say "Oh well, the fetus just died." Life begins on Conception!

what about the parents that wont be able to raise their kids? ever heard of the phrase, "put me out of my misery"? why bring them into the world i you know they wont be taken care of?
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#360 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 07 September 2008 - 11:57 PM

The mother shouldn't have the choice. The baby should be able to live. Abortion is immoral and murder. If a pregnant mother was say, hit by a car and the baby was killed, everyone would say "the baby was killed." No one would say "Oh well, the fetus just died." Life begins on Conception!

what about the parents that wont be able to raise their kids? ever heard of the phrase, "put me out of my misery"? why bring them into the world i you know they wont be taken care of?

A simple answer, adoption, lol...

Edited by ♠ Sucramnella, 07 September 2008 - 11:57 PM.

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#361 Shadow

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:01 AM

what about the parents that wont be able to raise their kids? ever heard of the phrase, "put me out of my misery"? why bring them into the world i you know they wont be taken care of?

This. If the parent wants to have an abortion, there are only two possibilities.1) The parents are unable (financially, physically, mentally, etc) unable to raise their child. The parents want to treat the child well, but they won't be able to. The child will live a miserable life.2) The parents don't want to take care of the child. They don't give a damn, so the child will be treated like crap until they move out. Even once they move out, the trauma from that horrible experience will result in their leading a miserable life.Either way, the kid is not going to live a good life, so why shouldn't the parent be allowed to have an abortion?
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#362 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:09 AM

what about the parents that wont be able to raise their kids? ever heard of the phrase, "put me out of my misery"? why bring them into the world i you know they wont be taken care of?A simple answer, adoption, lol...

my cousin got adopted cuzz his mom(my aunt) was a drugadict. he now wants to kill himself because of his foster parents. he would much rather live with his mom. and even more than that, he wishes he was never born. you always have to know that even though in a lot of cases, kids will be happy to get adopted, theres always the few that dont.

This. If the parent wants to have an abortion, there are only two possibilities.1) The parents are unable (financially, physically, mentally, etc) unable to raise their child. The parents want to treat the child well, but they won't be able to. The child will live a miserable life.2) The parents don't want to take care of the child. They don't give a damn, so the child will be treated like crap until they move out. Even once they move out, the trauma from that horrible experience will result in their leading a miserable life.Either way, the kid is not going to live a good life, so why shouldn't the parent be allowed to have an abortion?

thats exactly what im asking. you basically supported my argument, so thanks.
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#363 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:09 AM

This. If the parent wants to have an abortion, there are only two possibilities.1) The parents are unable (financially, physically, mentally, etc) unable to raise their child. The parents want to treat the child well, but they won't be able to. The child will live a miserable life.2) The parents don't want to take care of the child. They don't give a damn, so the child will be treated like crap until they move out. Even once they move out, the trauma from that horrible experience will result in their leading a miserable life.Either way, the kid is not going to live a good life, so why shouldn't the parent be allowed to have an abortion?

And in both of those possibilities the parents could put the baby up for adoption... Letting the baby live a life without murdering it and the parents don't have to deal with it.

my cousin got adopted cuzz his mom(my aunt) was a drugadict. he now wants to kill himself because of his foster parents. he would much rather live with his mom. and even more than that, he wishes he was never born. you always have to know that even though in a lot of cases, kids will be happy to get adopted, theres always the few that dont.

Wow... "you always have to know that even though in a lot of cases, kids will be happy to get adopted, theres always the few that dont." So you are going to kill all of the babies you say will have a good life so you can avoid the few that will have a bad life. I don't think the phrase is "kill millions to save some." Even if it was that wouldn't make sense because your "saving" some would be just killing them.

Edited by ♠ Sucramnella, 08 September 2008 - 12:13 AM.

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#364 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:13 AM

And in both of those possibilities the parents could put the baby up for adoption... Letting the baby live a life without murdering it and the parents don't have to deal with it.

theres still nothing wrong with it. what if your a drug addict and you dont want to have a baby with something wrong with it? thats the way it is most of the time if you do take drugs. and how do you think the parents will feel if theyre blood child is given to someone else because they couldnt take care of it themselves? i know that would make me feel inferior, and it would cause problems.
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#365 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:17 AM

my cousin got adopted cuzz his mom(my aunt) was a drugadict. he now wants to kill himself because of his foster parents. he would much rather live with his mom. and even more than that, he wishes he was never born. you always have to know that even though in a lot of cases, kids will be happy to get adopted, theres always the few that dont.

Wow... "you always have to know that even though in a lot of cases, kids will be happy to get adopted, theres always the few that dont." So you are going to kill all of the babies you say will have a good life so you can avoid the few that will have a bad life. I don't think the phrase is "kill millions to save some." Even if it was that wouldn't make sense because your "saving" some would be just killing them.

theres still nothing wrong with it. what if your a drug addict and you dont want to have a baby with something wrong with it? thats the way it is most of the time if you do take drugs. and how do you think the parents will feel if theyre blood child is given to someone else because they couldnt take care of it themselves? i know that would make me feel inferior, and it would cause problems.

So are you saying we should create a perfect world. "Kill all the challenged people?" Referencing Hitler...

Edited by ♠ Sucramnella, 08 September 2008 - 12:18 AM.

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#366 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:21 AM

@sucramnella: are you saying that your going to stop all the people from getting an abortion when they have every right to? im just listing a reason why people are justified in having abortions. im not saying everyone should have an abortion because of it.

Wow... "you always have to know that even though in a lot of cases, kids will be happy to get adopted, theres always the few that dont." So you are going to kill all of the babies you say will have a good life so you can avoid the few that will have a bad life. I don't think the phrase is "kill millions to save some." Even if it was that wouldn't make sense because your "saving" some would be just killing them.So are you saying we should create a perfect world. "Kill all the challenged people?" Referencing Hitler...

no, its just another reason why parents are gonna have an abortion. its another reason why people have them. they might feel ashamed for it.
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#367 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:25 AM

@sucramnella: are you saying that your going to stop all the people from getting an abortion when they have every right to? im just listing a reason why people are justified in having abortions. im not saying everyone should have an abortion because of it.no, its just another reason why parents are gonna have an abortion. its another reason why people have them. they might feel ashamed for it.

The have no right to abort.1. Life begins at conception is a scientifically proven fact. At this point in time you have a newly created being (no longer mom or dad, but combination of both), with unique human DNA (not a different animal or plant), the cell is ALIVE and will grow and develop unless it is KILLED.2. The US Declaration of Independence clearly states that all men are CREATED equal, and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, first and foremost the RIGHT TO LIFE. When were you CREATED?The baby has the right to live.

Edited by ♠ Sucramnella, 08 September 2008 - 12:26 AM.

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#368 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:30 AM

The have no right to abort.1. Life begins at conception is a scientifically proven fact. At this point in time you have a newly created being (no longer mom or dad, but combination of both), with unique human DNA (not a different animal or plant), the cell is ALIVE and will grow and develop unless it is KILLED.2. The US Declaration of Independence clearly states that all men are CREATED equal, and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, first and foremost the RIGHT TO LIFE. When were you CREATED?

hence why this is one of(if not the single) most argued debates out there. where as you follow the rules down to the very fine print, people like me allow for exceptions. you see see the child as an individual, i see the child as almost a type of property. its up to the parents what they do with their kids. harsh as that sounds, theres nothing to be done about it, and i dont think anything should be done about it.
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#369 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:36 AM

hence why this is one of(if not the single) most argued debates out there. where as you follow the rules down to the very fine print, people like me allow for exceptions. you see see the child as an individual, i see the child as almost a type of property. its up to the parents what they do with their kids. harsh as that sounds, theres nothing to be done about it, and i dont think anything should be done about it.

i see the child as almost a type of property.

That statement alone shows me that you have no morals. The child is an individual.

where as you follow the rules down to the very fine print, people like me allow for exceptions.

Hah, so you are implying that you are better than me because you allow exceptions to the foundational rules that our country was built upon. The Declaration of Independence, was not put up for exceptions.

Edited by ♠ Sucramnella, 08 September 2008 - 12:36 AM.

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#370 Guest_supabadman

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:39 AM

hence why this is one of(if not the single) most argued debates out there. where as you follow the rules down to the very fine print, people like me allow for exceptions. you see see the child as an individual, i see the child as almost a type of property. its up to the parents what they do with their kids. harsh as that sounds, theres nothing to be done about it, and i dont think anything should be done about it.

people are so pessimistic these days :(i agree with the other guy, there is an adoption choice, and whether or not you feel inferior you should still know that your in a better place because the parents couldnt take care of you no matter the circumstance.children as property? youd be a GREAT parent XD. nonetheless, abortion is taken if well... your too much of a coward to do so. the people who agree to abortions and have one have the same mind as you, seeing children as property and not a life. but in the end its the persons descision and no one on this forum can do anything about it.
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#371 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:43 AM

That statement alone shows me that you have no morals. The child is an individual.but in reality, do they have any power in the situation? no. they dont have any say, or any input. its only the parents.Hah, so you are implying that you are better than me because you allow exceptions to the foundational rules that our country was built upon. The Declaration of Independence, was not put up for exceptions.

and im not saying that im better than you, im just saying that we can keep arguing forever, and nothing will change because we are different. and even though the DI wasnt made for exceptions, there always will be exceptions. you always have to look at the circumstances. in a small way way, the presdent of the US is an exception, as people will give him the benefit of the doubt. how can we avoid that? we cant. just like we cant avoid abortions because theres always if we did do what you want to do, the states would be in an uproar. the govt would lose control because its not right making someone have baby thats not ready to have one.
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#372 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:43 AM

people are so pessimistic these days :(i agree with the other guy, there is an adoption choice, and whether or not you feel inferior you should still know that your in a better place because the parents couldnt take care of you no matter the circumstance.children as property? youd be a GREAT parent :). nonetheless, abortion is taken if well... your too much of a coward to do so. the people who agree to abortions and have one have the same mind as you, seeing children as property and not a life. but in the end its the persons descision and no one on this forum can do anything about it.

I agree with everything except "but in the end its the persons descision." Because according to the Declaration each person was created equal and is endowed the certain inalienable rights. The right to live. So I believe it is the child's right to live and the parents are not entitled to chose for it.
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#373 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:52 AM

people are so pessimistic these days :(i agree with the other guy, there is an adoption choice, and whether or not you feel inferior you should still know that your in a better place because the parents couldnt take care of you no matter the circumstance.children as property? youd be a GREAT parent :). nonetheless, abortion is taken if well... your too much of a coward to do so. the people who agree to abortions and have one have the same mind as you, seeing children as property and not a life. but in the end its the persons descision and no one on this forum can do anything about it.

i didnt say adoption wasnt a choice! why do you guys keep saying that? abortion is a choice, and so is adoption! i know people that have done both.and yes, i will make a GREAT parent, when im 30. lol i dont plan on getting any kids untill i know i can take of them.and just because you have an abortion doesnt mean your a coward. it just means your not ready.and in MY life, my parents are my masters. i cant do anything about it. they have all the power, so technically, i am their property. thats the way it is with most of my friends too lol sure, you can argue with them, but that doesnt do you any good. well, it never did me any good, even if i was right.
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#374 Guest_♠ Sucramnella

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 12:59 AM

i didnt say adoption wasnt a choice! why do you guys keep saying that? abortion is a choice, and so is adoption! i know people that have done both.and yes, i will make a GREAT parent, when im 30. lol i dont plan on getting any kids untill i know i can take of them.and just because you have an abortion doesnt mean your a coward. it just means your not ready.and in MY life, my parents are my masters. i cant do anything about it. they have all the power, so technically, i am their property. thats the way it is with most of my friends too lol sure, you can argue with them, but that doesnt do you any good. well, it never did me any good, even if i was right.

You will not make a great parent if you refer to children as property.
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#375 Guest_behindthenine

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Posted 08 September 2008 - 01:03 AM

thats all parents do is boss their children around anyways. no matter what they CALL it, the facts are that if you dont boss your kids around they get spoiled, and then ur screwed. and i would view my kids as my property, and as individuals. so dont judge me.we need to get back on topic though. abortions, not how well im going to do at being a parent.
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